The following is the Windows Setup and BCDEdit chat transcript. It is also
posted in the Microsoft Connect site with all previous transcripts at http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?linkid=50437&clcid=0x436.
We maxed out at 185 participants and 114 questions were answered.
Date: Monday, January 09, 2006
SamW [MS] (Moderator):
Welcome to our chat
today. I have members of the setup team with us and also a person from out base
team who is a program manager for BCDEdit. Keep this in mind as you formulate
your questions. With that I’ll have people start introducing themselves. As we
do that you can start submitting your questions.
James [MS] (Expert):
Hi there!
I'm James, a software test engineer on the Windows Beta Team. I help with Setup
issues mainly, and a few other areas as well. Let the questions
come!
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Hello I'm Elliott. I'm a test manager in
the OS Deployment team. Looking forward to helping you out this
morning.
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
I am Doug Allen (dougall), the Beta Lead
for the Windows Vista Beta Program in PSS Support. I've been a part of the
Longhorn Beta for about 9 months. I'm normally a Support Engineer in Platforms
Support with the Setup team, and I've been with Microsoft for 5 and a half
years.
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Hello! I work with the Kernel Platform team
dealing with Boot Manager and technologies around it.
My team also owns Boot Configuration Data.
Scottmca[MS] (Expert):
Hello my
name is Scott McArthur and I am a PSS Beta Engineer working on Vista
Dean Frost [MS]
(Expert):
Hi, my name is Dean Frost and I work on the
beta test team on setup.
jeffpatt [MS] (Expert):
Hi, I’m a Beta Support
Engineer on the Setup team.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: is there an option in setup to change my
user name from "Windows User" to my real name?
A: from the Setup
UI no- this can be changed with unattend.xml
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: Had a
lot of trouble with early builds getting SATA to work. Is that better in latest
builds?
A: early builds did have issues with SATA drives. In
builds 5270 or higher many of these issues have been
resolved.
Stephen Lodwick [MS]
(Expert):
Q: How do you enable debugging BOOTMGR
and/or WINLOAD?
A: There are two ways to enable BOOTMGR
debugging:
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Q: Where can we learn more about this new
DUAL BOOT system that's built into Vista?
A: There is limited
documentation about boot configuration data that is online now. You can find
them here BCD FAQ
<http://www.microsoft.com/technet/windowsvista/library/85cd5efe-c349-427c-b035-c2719d4af778.mspx>
BCD WDK help
<http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/driver/tips/debug_vista.mspx>
<http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/driver/tips/drv-tools.mspx>
BCD WMI provider
<http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/BCD/bcd/portal.asp>
Eventually there will be more documentation and kb articles regarding
this.
Thanks!
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
Q: Is it possible to set up a dual boot
with WinXP x64 and Vista x64? If so, how? Every time I have tried, the WinXP
install gets trashed.
A: You can run the fixntfs tool from the
root of the Vista install to fix that issue
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: Is
there any reason for setup (new install) being very slow on a Virtual Machine
(VS 2005 R2)?
A: builds post 5270 have had performace
improvements. the next CTP build will be better.
Scottmca[MS] (Expert):
Q: I have
successfully loaded the build 5270 and it is functioning within our
requirements, however, I notice that the Security Center does not find our
McAfee Anti-Virus. Is there something I can do about that?
A: This
is something we are aware of and later builds should incorporate support for
detecting antivirus software correctly.
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: Does
this scope of this chat include TVCard / INF / Setup type issues?
A:
sorry no.
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Is there any reason for setup (new
install) being very slow on a Virtual Machine (VS 2005 R2)?
A:
Yes. Windows Vista has not been optimized for use in VMs yet. There have
been a large number of changes with Vista, and subsequently a lot of issues with
the VM additions. With Virtual Server 2005 R2 and 5270 (Dec CTP), you are able
to install the built-in VM additions without an issue.
We are aware that it does take a very long time to install in VM right now,
and that will get better as we progress.
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: Why
setup takes 4 hours?
A: the next CTP build will address setup
performance issues.
Scottmca[MS] (Expert):
Q: Why does the setup
program ask for your computer name twice, once at the very beginning of the
setup and again at the very end when creating users?
A: This is a
known issue that is resolved post 5270 builds. You should only get one prompt
then
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Will there be an "Advanced" option for
setup so we can enter our user names, workgroup names etc. during setup.
Otherwise it will take having some network problems (can't connect to the rest
of the workgroup) and a reboot to figure out and correct the WG
A:
no this will not be possible from the setup ui. Advanced configurations can
be done with unattend.xml.
Dean
Frost [MS] (Expert):
Q: It would be nice to see some
type better visual indicators that something is happening during installation
rather than a progress bar that appears to be stagnant.
A: The
setup process speed should be increasing progressively from build to build. As
it improves, you should actually see the progress bar moving, and not seem so
stagnant. Adding more information to setup as to what is going on, is being
looked into as well.
Stephen
Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q: How do you enable debugging
BOOTMGR and/or WINLOAD?
A: You can enable boot debugging throught
the setup command line:
1) "/debug:<port> /baudrate:<baudrate>" This will enable
debugging for the final OS installation including during Setup.
2) If you have already installed the Vista OS and you are logged into the
desktop, you can launch an elevated command prompt and run the follwoing
command: "bcdedit bootdebug on" You will have to reboot, and then you will have
bootdebugging enabled.
James
[MS] (Expert):
Q: I saw that with the 5270 build the
setup improved greatly including the setup of users at the end of the setup. The
problem with it currently is that it leaves the Administrator account active and
no password and not even prompting for a password. Bad?!
A: This
is a known issue about which we are definitely aware. It's definitely a bad
thing (from a security standpoint) and it's something that is planned on being
resolved before we ship.
Dougall
[MS] (Expert):
Q: How does SETUPAPI logging (or the
equivalent) work in Vista/LH? Will the whitepaper that describes SETUPAPI
logging be updated for Vista?
A: The SetupAPI logs have now been
broken out into 2 files ... setupapi.dev.log and setupapi.app.log. They're for
now located in the Windows\INF directory. I do not know the plans for updating
the whitepaper, but I would assume so.
Srivatsa (Expert):
Q: Is there any chance to
get an visual boot menu editor if using more than one OS on a pc ?
A:
You can do boot menu editing with bcdedit tool today. You can do limited
editing like changing timeout and changing default from My
Computer>Properties>Advanced tab>startup and recovery
settings.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Are we going to have a "live mode",
booting from CD, to fix small problems with our computers? It would really help
(say, if we needed to back up files or restore a backup)
A: We
don't have the same functionality, but we have a few things that can replace it.
Part 1 is the "System Recovery Troubleshooter" available from the first dialog
on a media boot -- this will allow you to fixup bootsectors, copy files, etc.
Part 2 would be an in-place upgrade (functionally more equivalent to the legacy
recovery); if your OS can boot just upgrade to the same
build.
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
Q: When will the next CTP be released?
Before the TAP launch on Jan 25?
A: We cannot say at this time the
exact planned dates for the next CTP release or any build for that matter. If
you are a TAP customer, please follow up with your TAP Program Manager for
specific details.
Stephen
Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q: my main question for the
experts regarding setup; Is it possible to wright a instruction, FAQ or
something alike, so the less experienced users are also able to do a setup with
Vista?
A: We are limiting the number of actual Setup screens the
user sees and adding context sensitive help for each of the screens. Hopefully,
this will make it a smoother install experience. In addition, there will be
additional help available (including the readme) on the autorun screen when the
DVD is launched.
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
Q: is there a major difference btw build
5270 and 5219
A: Yes
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: Is there a way to
load 3rd party storage drivers (the old F6 option)? If so, do those drivers need
to be signed? If so, how does a developer get a test driver signed to work under
fresh installation?
A: when booting from the DVD, at the disk
configurations page, you will see a button called "advanced" then you will see
another button called "load driver". This will act the same as old F6. However,
you will now be able to load drivers from floppy, disk on key, CDROM, any
removable device. As for the signed vs. unsigned this is still an design
issue.
Scottmca[MS]
(Expert):
Q: What happened to the "repair" option
durin install? Is it coming back? If not, why not?
A: The ability
to repair a system has been moved to the Windows Recovery Environment(WINRE)
which you can get to by booting off the Vista DVD. There is some information
about it in the help
Dougall
[MS] (Expert):
Q: Dougall: Do you have to enable
SETUPAPI logging with a registry change? What's the enablement
mechanism?
A: No there is nothing additional as far as I know to
enable general setupapi logging.
Dean Frost [MS] (Expert):
Q: Will there be an
way to load hdd driver froms medias like usb-devices and cd's in
future?
A: USB devices should be currently supported, as a number
of beta users have used that method. If this is not working currently for you,
please file a bug and we can look into it. You might also check if USB is
supported by your motherboard, as this would cause a problem if not supported.
CD, I believe is supported as well. If you are having an issue, again please
file a bug and we can try to troubleshoot.
Dougall [MS] (Expert):
Q: Which
versions of VM Additions should be used with 5270. Myself I found v13.552 be the
best (from VS R2)... but are there udates on the way?
A: For now,
the VM Additions that we are telling everyone to use is the updated additions
with VS2005 R2. Improvements and changes in Vista will increase speed and
performance outside of the VM additions.
SamW [MS] (Moderator):
Q: I have
noticed since the days of Windows 9x & ME we have lost the ability to choose
what is installed with Windows. Why can't we specify what components we want to
install like Windows 95 days and what Linux setups do now?
A: A
lot of the feedback we have recieved over the years has been to simplify setup.
The feedback we have been getting is for fewer choices. So this has been a
conscious decision and we realize that for some people like power users it might
not be what they would prefer.
Stephen Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q: How does
SETUPAPI logging (or the equivalent) work in Vista/LH? Will the whitepaper that
describes SETUPAPI logging be updated for Vista?
A: You will find
that SETUPAPI logging has improved extensively from prior releases of Windows.
The SETUPAPI logs now live in the %windir%\inf directory under the name of
setupapi.dev.log and setupapi.app.log. I find the dev log is most useful and has
added quite a bit more diagnostics information. There is also a registry key
that controls the amount of information that is logged to the file. I am not
certain that the whitepaper will be updated but assume that many of the
diagnostic data is the same as in past releases.
Srivatsa (Expert):
Q: Stephen
Lodwick: You said " There are two ways to enable BOOTMGR debugging: " but that
is all that came through. What are the two ways?
A: bcdedit -set
{BOOTMGR} BOOTDEBUG on
bcdedit -set {GUID_OF_LOADER} DEBUG on
Thanks.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: At this time headless setup does not
appear to be present. How soon will headless setup be supported?
A:
Headless setup is present in 5270. The functionality is targeted at systems
that are configured as headless-enabled in the BIOS -- in this scenario we will
output data to the port listener about the state of setup (action logs and error
logs). We do not have the same attended setup scenario in place in Vista as we
did in legacy Server builds -- look for the attended-headless setup to firm up
in later OS builds as we get closer to Server
scenarios.
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
Q: what is the good amount of ram one
should have to experience vista?
A: I would say a good "general"
amount would be 512MB - 1GB. I have had good experiences with both amounts of
RAM, of course, the more, the better :)
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: When will we be able
to "upgrade" XP?
A: look for the next CTP.
:-)
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
Q: I haven't had a successful install of
vista yet. I'm working with the 5270 release. Either I get a foundation error
during install, or it will install and not be able to find the
ntoskernel.
A: This foundation install error is most likely
because you are seeing a known issue when lauching setup from WinPE 2005 (win2k3
sp1) ... is that how you are running setup?
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: Is
there a sysprep available for the 5270 build?
A: yes- its
installed as part of the OS now.
Dougall [MS] (Expert):
Q: what is the good
amount of ram one should have to experience vista?
A: You should
be using a minimum recommended size of 512meg.
Dean Frost [MS] (Expert):
Q:
Could you guys give us freecell or tetris or something to do while setup is
running?
A: While this is an excellent idea, that I would
personally be a fan of, I believe we have many, much larger, higher priority
issues to take care of first. Maybe we can get this in the next release of
Windows. :)
Scottmca[MS]
(Expert):
Q: Are there going to be seperate media for
the different SKU's or will the version be dependent on the product key
entered?
A: it will be dependent on the product key
entered
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: When can we expect to see an optimized
version of the setup program so installs don't take 1.25 hours?
A:
While speed optimization is an ongoing process, you should notice *big*
speed improvements for Setup in the next build we
release.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: How can you extract WINPE from the setup
DVD (how do you create a bootable WINPE CD)?
A: this will not be
supported. WinPE will now be broadly available for
customers.
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Q: does vista build 5270 have the ntldr
file in it? . one of the two installs says, ntldr is missing. . i redownloaded
the iso and burned to dvd at 1x speed. . i looked through the entire dvd and
could not find, ntldr. thanks.
A: It seems for some reason old
bootcode that looks for NTLDR is running on the boot partition. Try running
"fixntfs -lh all". I am assuming you have ntfs running.
Probably, the next (Feb) CTP/IDW build you will see a tool called
bootsect.exe that will do the same. Fixntfs is a temporary tool.
Thanks
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
Q: -what- exactly is going to increase
setup speed during installation in later builds?
A: We are using a
new build process called staging, which in effect is that we are pre-sysprepping
the builds internally before release so that we can cut down on a lot of the
one-time action items that have to happen during setup. I average about 30
minutes on my staged build installs.
Srivatsa (Expert):
Q: Is this setup team also
owner of the Bcdedit tool? (soory if asked already, but I just
arrived
A: Setup does not own this tool, my team, Kernel Platform
Team owns this one, send your questions/suggestions my way.
Thanks.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Since the same DVD will be used for both
server and client editions, will there be anything to stop someone from say
Server 2003 upgrading to vista client or from xp to vista server?
A:
setup will block unsupported scenarios.
Stephen Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q:
What causes the video to hang during the last stage of the installation? I
have a box on which I never see the post installation configuration screen (the
OOBE). The system is installed but it takes a reboot to find this
out.
A: Hi Colin - We have seen this as well and there are two
issues that will help alleviate this in future builds:
1) Quite a few problems with video drivers. Individual driver issues that
cause hangs have been identified and fixed. However, there are still some
problems being reported and triaged.
2) Fixes to imaging and the hardware specific registry entries. There have
been some specific fixes that clean out hardware information for a staged
installation. The result is a cleaner install for a staged build. We have seen a
large reduction in the number of device hangs because of these fixes.
Both of these will be available in the next CTP.
James [MS] (Expert):
Q: When can
we have the WAIK tools for 5270, or at least the documentation, around
unattended installs, sysprep, usmt etc... (forgot the ATE box)
A:
The WAIK is not available for everybody, but we do plan on releasing a newer
build. Once we do, those people who have access to it will be notified of
this.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: re q94 does that mean customers will be
able to get hold of WINPE 2.0 officially
A: We just posted
something about this up on TechNet. We're making WinPE widely available -- there
may be some restrictions on who can use it, but anyone should be able to
download for evaluation and development.
Joscon [MSFT] (Expert):
Q: Not
that I have a preference - but will Vista be shipped on DVD and CD?
A:
There should be both, spanned CD and DVD
Joscon [MSFT] (Expert):
Q: 1.
How has setup changed since Windows XP?
A: Simple answer, Vista is
now image based
Scottmca[MS]
(Expert):
Q: With your over view in numbers and lab
availability for the teams that own parts of Vista, have you all seen any
problems with dual booting XP and Vista 5270 (using separate partition) or any
reasons not to do this?
A: Dual booting works best if you install
XP first then install Vista. If not then you will have to utilize bcdedit to
allow the system to dual boot
Dean Frost [MS] (Expert):
Q: In 5270 there was
no option to set the Administrator password during install. Is this option going
to be put back in the next build? It is very bad that the administrator password
is blank.
A: The information I have is that this should be
implemented by beta 2. Possibly sooner.
James [MS] (Expert):
Q: When
entering in the Key either to install Server Core Edition or any other Edition
(If not allready), will it give you a notice to tell you what Windows Vista
Edition you are installing?
A: There will be no notice from Setup
about this, because once we ship people will be quite aware of which edition
they've purchased before they even enter it into
Setup.
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Drivers drivers drivers - why are you
guys not bundeling old drivers with these releases? I've got NIC cards that
can't get identified, but in XP it was built into the OS installer and found
them just fine.
A: We are including some legacy drivers and some
we are not. We have established a certain bar of acceptable driver stability,
and if the vendor is not willing to support / update their driver and hardware,
we pull the driver from inbox. We will be putting alot of the legacy driver
packages on Windows Update.
We look at hardware types and platforms and the direction of the technology.
Windows XP does contain some drivers that might have been old and outdated to XP
but still were included. As we move into the Vista timeframe, we are phasing out
support for legacy hardware that is no longer being supported by the vendors or
is discontinued, referring to including drivers
INBOX.
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Q: Will Microsoft disclose specification of
BCD format so that Linux tool can be used to create and modify it?
A:
There are no plans to disclose BCD format. The interfaces available with
Vista will be BCD WMI provider and bcdedit.exe. There will be documentation
explaining the highlevel architecture of BCD.
Thanks.
Stephen Lodwick [MS]
(Expert):
Q: What is the "staged build" we hear about
in hushed tones on the beta groups?
A: A "staged build" is a build
that has been installed, sysprep'ed, and imaged. This is how most large
customers (OEMs, Corporations, etc) deploy Windows. There are several benefits
of this type of installation: consistency of experience (less moving parts),
more reliable, and quicker install times.
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q:
Elliott : Even though it isn't supported, can you tell me how can you
extract WINPE from the setup DVD?
A: We'd tell you but the men in
black suits are threatening us at the door. :) But you can get the WinPE
experience by booting to your product media and using option 3 on the first menu
-- "system repair". Hit the "next" button on the first menu and the last option
presented will be "command prompt". Now you've got the WinPE experience without
the hassle of creating anything unsupported. For more details on getting
legitimate WinPE copies see our recent announcement on
TechNet.
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Will you be notifying us when a release
is ready for testing with the WAIK?
A: We will be notifying those
who have access to the WAIK builds, yes.
Joscon [MSFT] (Expert):
Q: can
one create multiple items for legacy OS in bcdedit ( and with this boot.ini no
longer needed) and getting multiple legacy startup options listed by the new
bootmanager?
A: Yes you can create and list multiple items in the
BCD
SamW [MS]
(Moderator):
Q: How about a "power-user" mode that
actually allows us to see what is being done? Sorta like booting to safe mode
does?
A: There won't be anything specified in the setup itself.
This is something that you would need to do with the Migration Tool or via an
unattended setup Answer file.
Joscon [MSFT] (Expert):
Q: Will Vista play DVD
movies without the need of installation of software like PowerDVD,
...?
A: No, you still need a DVD
decoder
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: 5270 cannot be installed by booting from
dvd (hangs immediately) and installing from within xp gives 'error copying
files'. But it can be installed on virtual server'05 by using the same dvd in
the same dvdrw drive. Why?
A: Well, that sounds like a bug, but
not one I've seen before. I'd suggest filing a bug on each
issue.
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
Q: Thanks very much for the dual boot
headsup. I'm about to do it and I would very much appreciate any other tips and
particularly the size of partition or anything at all I can do to optimize my
install.
A: I always like to keep dual boots on separate physical
drives personally, other than that, keep the installs to different partitions
and you will be fine. Install legacy operating systems like Windows XP
first.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
to clarify, are you asking, when will setup
support upgradews or when during the setup process we ask to do a
upgrade?
Dougall [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Office 12 beta OK with Vista beta 1 or
beta 2?
A: Vista 5270 is not a supported platform yet for Office
12 Beta 1. It might work, but you will run into issues with WRP issues. You can
get around it, but as I understand it, the next release of O12 will be supported
on Vista.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: In Q82, you indicated that sysprep is in
5270--where do we find it?
A:
%windir%\system32\sysprep
James [MS] (Expert):
Q: Will beta testers be
getting a free cd/dvd once vista is officially launched? :P
A: No
final decisions are made on that.
Scottmca[MS] (Expert):
Q: The Bcedit tool from
the Kernel Platform team then will replace boot.ini from 5270
forward?
A: Yes. Take a look here for some more information on
BCD:
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/windowsvista/library/85cd5efe-c349-427c-b035-c2719d4af778.mspx
Stephen Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q:
Drivers drivers drivers - why are you guys not bundeling old drivers with
these releases? I've got NIC cards that can't get identified, but in XP it was
built into the OS installer and found them just fine.
A: This is a
great question. However, out of the scope of this discussion. I will mention,
that there is a supplimental drivers disk that will contain know mass storage,
video, and networking drivers that have high attach rates. This will certainly
help out in most situations.
James [MS] (Expert):
Q: Will the issue of
install time be fixed so it doesn't take over an hour to install windows
Vista
A: This is definitely something that is planned on being
fixed, and you'll probably already notice big improvements in the next build we
release to the TechBeta.
Richard
[MS] (Expert):
Q: When installing, does the Vista
installer perform any checks on the harddisk before installing - checking for
bad sectors etc. which could potentially cause setup to fail?
A:
We have some checks in place to look for hard disk failures (these are
limited to drives that report them via a certain framework) but we don't do a
chkdsk-like process. While this was looked at, it took too long to get
meaningful failure data and it didn't make a large difference in reliability.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Why is during setup asked if you are
allowing to activate Vista during setup and never do this.
A: the
checkbox to allow autoactivation will be working in future CTP
releases
Dean Frost [MS]
(Expert):
Q: My biggest problem with the installation
in 5270 is the lack of information. It's hard to tell if its doing anything.
Could we maybe have a sort of "Copying xxx.dll" text? It would really help tell
that the installation hasn't died.
A: This is being looked into.
Unfortunately no concrete information at this time.
Dougall [MS] (Expert):
Q: if you
reduce your inbox driver support significally you loose a big advantage over Lx,
how do you respond?
A: We are not reducing inbox driver support.
We have added many new devices and have dropped some legacy drivers, but they
will still be available on Windows Update.
SamW [MS] (Moderator):
Q: There
is something wrong with the chat. IU have been trying for a half hour to log int
and couldn't. Please advise
A: You can eamail me directly about
this and I'll see if I can forward it to the proper people, but chances are that
we won't be able to diagnose what might have been happening. Sorry for the
inconvience.
Stephen Lodwick
[MS] (Expert):
Q: What are the chances of seeing some
sort of mini-browser during the setup so if users need to have 8 GB free, they
could browse the partition from the setup and delete a few files to get it down
to an installable size?
A: There will not be a mini-browser
available but you can press "SHIFT-F10" while the OS is installing. This will
open a command prompt and allow you to remove files and
leisure.
SamW [MS]
(Moderator):
Q: Sam: This isn't exactly related to
Setup, but will it be possible to get a chat with the UX/Sidebar
team?
A: I'll see what I can do. Send me an email so I don't
forget. :)
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Drivers as everyone knows are the main
problem. Microsoft can build any software they like but suppliers like HP cannot
or will not write drivers for the 64 bit OS of XP so why should our customers
look forward to installing Vista?
A: As 64 bit becomes more
mainstream the drivers will come around; please trust that we are doing
everything we can to motivate the marketplace to make this happen. In this case
(as you mentioned) we're in the same boat as you -- we have to wait for the
market to deliver.
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: When I went to install Windows Vista of
Dec build, it would not let me reazd the release notes. It told me that they are
not found. Will this be fixed in future builds
A: We haven't
encountered this problem or heard of anyone else encountering this problem.
However, the release notes will not be in the same place or in the same form
once we ship.
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Q: Srivista [90] See the setup iand
installation newsgroup for worries anbout bcdedit
A: I am tuned in
to setup and migration newgroup. It would be great if the questions are posted
in a consolidated way. I know that Vinny had created a seperate thread for
bcdedit.exe issues.
Thanks.
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
Q: Could you make BCDEdit an option for
users who do not want it?
A: BCD will be our new boot environment
moving forward
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Will there be a change for name of the
install of Windows Codename Longhorn to Windows Vista? When will this be taking
place
A: There's been no decision made on this yet, so it's still
up in the air.
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: ... old partition. Would it be possible
for this feature to be part of the Windows-based Setup?
A: Sorry,
your question is not clear. Can you clarify and repost?
Thanks.
Dean Frost [MS]
(Expert):
Q: In the 5270 build documentation stated
that it included both Vista and Longhorn server...How do we get to longhorn
server on the installation media?
A: This easiest way would be to
use the same imagine you currently have, and enter the server product key,
instead of the Vista key, when prompted. This should install server for you.
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Am I correct in think that 5270 is not
feauture complete? Is it planned for the next build to be feature
complete?
A: It is largely feature-complete, but we're still
trying to get some of the last planned features in.
Richard [MS] (Expert):
Q: Why do
Vista setup leave a copy of \build on the harddrive? I believe they are
duplicate from DVD.
A: Some pieces come into place later than
others and the cleanup code usually lags. We're going to do a better job of
pruning the directories installed on your machine during the next CTP and look
for this to continue to improve as staged builds come online (soon-ish) and we
continue to look at this.
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: When will Vista
support upgrade from one Build to another?
A: build to build
upgrades are not typically supported. However, for each externally dropped build
guidence will be given on what paths will be supported.
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Q: Will it be possible for third parties to
write "Boot applications" that BOOTMGR would load (similar to the memory tester
boot app?)
A: This will not be possible with Windows Vista. But
the design of Boot Environment does allow for such an extension in the
future.
Thanks
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: I wanted to install a clean Vista ontop
of an old Longhorn on a separate partition. I was disappointed that the
Windows-based Setup did not offer the "Advanced" button the boot-from-DVD Setup
had that would allow me to delete and re-create the ...
A: This is
something we're discussing internally -- there are a lot of concerns about
complicating some rollback scenarios, etc, but this is certainly functionality
that we want to provide. I'll go add another request to the pile under
consideration.
Stephen Lodwick
[MS] (Expert):
Q: Will the next build or the final
copy of Vista be just on DVD or maybe on CD
A: Vista is currently
only available for DVD while other formats have not been decided. It may depend
on demand for a spanned media installation.
Elliott [MS] (Expert):
Q: In the
next CTP build will the Vista boot screen be changed to reflect the actual name
of the OS? :)
A: yes
Dean Frost [MS] (Expert):
Q: Can be media
center enabled on normal PC? I downloaded and installed the update, but I still
get the "expiration" message. I use 5270 build.
A: There is an
update for MCE on the Connect Site, that can be downloaded, that should fix that
expiration problem.
Dougall
[MS] (Expert):
Q: couldn't try for myself, does 5270
support installing/booting from removable drive. If it doesn't will it support
at RTM?
A: Yes it does, but the BIOS has to support booting from a
USB device.
Scottmca[MS]
(Expert):
Q: Are we going to be able to build our
custom vista installations with XIMAGE and burn them on to a DVD that we can
keep, and install like the stock vista?
A: Yes Vista will support
the ability to create sysprepped images that you can deploy via various
methods(network, dvd, etc...)
Richard [MS] (Expert):
Q: When Vista Ships
will their be significant differences in the F8 Menu in XP (the Windows Advanced
Options Menu with the different Safe Modes and Last Known Good? Will repair
install booting from the CD or DVD be in a context of wider fix no boot
options?
A: The boot options part of this is a little unclear, but
we've broken our repair scenarios into a few different places. The update to the
old Command Console is called SRT, a much-more-functional text console that is
based on WinPE -- this offers the ability to repair bootsectors, fixup boot
options (bcd stuff) and repair non-boot problems. The old in-place-upgrade
functionality is available for times when the OS is broken but
bootable.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Im in the UK, and my keyboard defaults
to the US keyboard layout. Will there be an option to change this in setup, as
less experienced users may find it daunting to change control panel options on
first boot?
A: yes this should be enabled for
beta2.
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Would it be possible to make the Windows
Feature component in Ad/Remove Programs a part setup, so we can pick and choose
whats installed?
A: As part of the push to reduce complexity we
removed this in XP -- today (as then) the functionality will be made available
through Unattended install parameters, but we do not plan to resurrect this UI.
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: When will we see the boot screen reflect
the name Windows Vista?
A: Usually this is done later in the
development process. I'd hazard a guess that it'll be in place in the final
release, but even that I'm not 100% certain of.
Stephen Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q:
Installshield routines that spawn additional processes appear to fall foul
of UAP and are blocked - is there a reccommended way of launching these so that
they install ok (have tried running eleveated and also command line installer
options to no avail)
A: Paul - unfortunately, this is out of scope
for this discussion. This would be answered better during a LUA
discussion.
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
Q: Will their be a gui version of BCEDIT
which I think is a variation of Leen's question that has been requested on the
news groups?
A: I dont beleive there will be a GUI version of
BCDEDIT, but of course, we're still in beta, so thats only a guess. There are
GUI ways to edit information in the BCD but not to the extent that you can in
BCDEDIT
SamW [MS]
(Moderator):
We have about 10 minutes left in the
chat session.
Elliott [MS]
(Expert):
hey everyone, I need to take off. this has
been fun. thanks.
James [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Will the format/and partion part of the
install be imporved to be quicker and easier to use
A: What sort
of results are you looking for? So far, it's pretty
fast.
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: will vista allow drivers in the setup
phase to be loaded from a removeable device other than a usb mapped as the
floppy drive ? most pcs now dont include an A:
A: Absolutely -- in
build 5270 you can load drivers from any removable device -- USB keys, CD-media
(eject setup, provide drivers, re-insert setup media) or floppy. Your drivers
need to be in the root of the device or in platform-specific subdirectories
(\i386, etc) to load.
jeffpatt
[MS] (Expert):
Q: is ipv6 enabled by default in
vista?
A: Yes, both IPv6 and IPv4 are enabled by default.
Dean Frost [MS]
(Expert):
Q: When will we be able to upgrade build
instead of doing a clean install each time?
A: Upgrade from Win
XP, 2000 should be available in beta 2. Upgrade from build to build is not
something we support. Sometimes updating from build to build is not blocked in
setup, but doing so creates an invalid testing scenario and invalidates any
related bugs.
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
Q: as an addon to the bootable vista floppy
question, is/will there a way to format a USB thumb drive to be
bootable?
A: The ability to boot a thumb drive is based on the
motherboards BIOS abilities....not Windows. If your motheboard can see the drive
as bootable, we will see it.
Richard [MS] (Expert):
Q: why isn't setup
restartable at certain stage, will that remain until rtm
A: We're
going to make setup so fast that failures simply rollback to your old OS and
tell you what bad thing prevented the process from succeeding.
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Q: [124] BCEDIT is hard to use / we ask for
some convenient tool (may be not a simple as editing boot.ini, but way easier
than bcdedit (this is it in a nutshell)
A: bcdedit.exe was
designed as a tool to make use of extensible design of BCD. As this is the only
generic tool available for editing boot configuration bcdedit.exe had to support
almost all the capabilities of BCD and had to cater accross a diverse consumer
base. Any tool that is designed to be as versatile will tend to be complex than
necessary. For Vista bcdedit.exe, startup and repair properties and MSCONFIG
will be the tools available to edit Boot Configuration.
Simpler tools can be easily designed using BCD WMI provider that cater to
custom needs.
Thanks.
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: If I copy the contents of the setup DVD
to the harddrive of a machine I want to install Vista on, could I boot Win PE
and then launch the install from the harddrive?
A: Yes. Make sure
that you use a version of WinPE that is based on Server Sp1 or Vista for this to
succeed, and make sure you have lots of free space. :)
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
Q: Joscon [234]: I was wondering about the
actual formating of the USB Thumb drive
A: You know, I havent
tested that myself.
Stephen
Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q: Hello everybody.. I want to
know is planned for Vista some kind of "All in one" about languages, instead of
have one version of Vista for each language, with the option to choose language
during setup? (sorry my english)
A: There are plans to make the
top tier languages available per piece of media. What this means is that a
product will be shipped that contains, for example, the EN-US language. There
are other media types that will be regional and have multiple languages
available. Through attended Setup, the user can select one language to view
Setup and to install on the system. You will be able to install multiple
languages through the unattend file.
Richard [MS] (Expert):
Q: [124] Vinnie sort of
gathers info, but there has been little feedback on status after 2 months of
practically silence from MS site ;-)
A: The process of getting
feedback into the builds and getting those builds released to you with that
feedback in it is not always as quick as we'd like, but please trust that Vinnie
is very vocal and a good advocate for your scenarios here. He has a lab that he
uses now to recreate these failures and makes everyone watch the issues.
Thanks.
Srivatsa
(Expert):
Q: After installing Vista (on a separate
partition) and attempting to dual-boot with XP Pro we are unable to boot into
Vista and simply get a black screen; we can use fixboot to get XP back up and
running, but any suggestions for getting Vista working?
A: Try
fixntfs -lh all. This will update the Vista Bootcode that will look for Vista
Boot manager.
Thanks
Joscon [MSFT]
(Expert):
good to know, what kind of drive was
that?
Stephen Lodwick [MS]
(Expert):
Q: Will there be a lanuage support for
Hebrew?
A: Yes.
Scottmca[MS] (Expert):
Q: I have tried to
install Windows Vista 5270 in Virtual PC...with no luck in recognizing the disk.
Is this a current limitation?
A: That should work although you
usually have to start the Vista setup, format the drive, then restart the Vista
DVD and run setup again.
Richard [MS] (Expert):
Q: Is my mother-in-law
on TAP? She always seems to know when I'm home. I know they get futuristic
components that we don't.
A: [m-i-l] Yes I am so watch what you
say... :)
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: What will happen to the setup in the
next release?
A: It will get faster and prettier, more functional
and increasingly stable.
James
[MS] (Expert):
Q: Will this chat be posted to the
system after this chat is over? What about private protection?
A:
Yes. I understand Sam has something to say on this in a little bit. I'm not
sure what you mean by "private protection," but if you're referring to whether
or not Private Messages will be posted, those won't be
posted.
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Q: What is the performance expectation of
Longhorn/Vista install/setup? I have not seen an install that can be completed
within an hour. We understand that it will be improved build to build. But will
the installation time for Vista shorter than W2k3?
A: The goal is
for this to be less than XP at time of release -- look for this to improve
dramatically when staged builds come online.
SamW [MS] (Moderator):
Thanks
for joining us today. This chat transcript will be posted shortly to the beta
newsgroups as well as on the Connect site.
Richard [MS] (Expert):
Q: Is it
possible for the Windows-based Setup to offer the same "Advanced" features the
DVD-boot Setup offers, such as managing partitions?
A: Not really
-- we're worried about scenarios where customers ask us to format their system
partition (maybe not their Windows partition) etc. So we restrict disk behavior
when setup is run from downlevel and push you to do the disk config tools in
your downlevel OS.
Stephen
Lodwick [MS] (Expert):
Q: SamW is this chat under
NDA?
A: Sam's machine is not responding, so I will answer. No,
this is not under NDA (per SamW)
James [MS] (Expert):
Q: When will the chat be
posted since I miss half of it tonight?
A: It will be posted
later.
Stephen Lodwick [MS]
(Expert):
Thanks all!
Scottmca[MS] (Expert):
Thanks
for all the great questions today
Srivatsa (Expert):
Thanks a lot for bringing
questions and suggestions. Appreciate it!
Richard [MS]
(Expert):
Thanks for the questions, I look forward to
doing this again.
James [MS]
(Expert):
I'm glad everyone enjoyed the chat. Thanks
for coming, we'll see you next time, and keep those bugs coming
in!